Episode 34: Empowering Women To Financial Freedom Featuring Liz Faircloth & Andresa Guidelli

Michelle: Welcome to the InFLOW Podcast. I am your host, Michelle Bosch. I have been excitedly waiting for today’s interview. I have two powerhouse women in real estate with me today as my guests, and we got introduced I think back in May of last year through a mutual friend. And my guests today are Andresa Guidelli and Liz Faircloth. And I’d like to first start by telling you a little bit about Andresa.

Andresa was born and raised in Brazil. And after finishing up her MBA, she made a bold move to come to the United States to start her second master’s degree in Professional Business Communication at La Salle University. So, I can totally identify with Andresa, she is a first generation immigrant just like me that I came to the U.S. to study and then we decided to somehow stay here for good. She specializes in full gut renovation projects, and building new construction developments in Philadelphia and in New Jersey.

She runs the day-to-day operations of her own construction projects, as well as those of other investors from single family to apartment complexes. She creates systems to ensure scalability, efficiency, quality. She sounds to me like the systems and process lady in her company. She also owns and manages a small rental portfolio in Philadelphia comprised of both long-term and short-term rentals. She is the co-founder of Monarch short-term rentals, long-term relationships, where she offers a five-step conversion package tailored for real estate investors who currently own long-term rentals and that wanna use them or diversify their portfolio and use them as short-term rentals as well.

And then my second guest today, of course, Liz Faircloth, also equally brilliant and amazing. And Liz began her interest in entrepreneurship and investing while attending University of Pennsylvania and the Wharton School of Business. She began her investing career along with her then fiancé, who’s now her husband, with the purchase of a duplex with a $30,000 loan outside of Philadelphia. And after selling this duplex and moving to New Jersey, she co-founded the DeRosa Group in 2005 with her husband Matt.

And they own a lot of commercial residential property and their mission is to transform lives through real estate. She has a vast experience in bringing properties to their highest and best use, repositioning, anywhere from single family all the way to large apartment buildings, mixed use retail office space. They control about 400 units of residential and commercial assets throughout the east coast. And she is also assisting in both the strategic vision of the company as well as the marketing communications. And she is also the proud founder of the DeRosa Gives initiative. And they both, I’ve been watching them now for like a little bit under a year, I believe they both have been guests in the top rated podcast, BiggerPockets. Is that correct, right?

Liz: Yes.

Michelle: And are the co-founders of the Real Estate Investor Show podcast, which I had the privilege of being interviewed by them. So, without any further ado, please, I would like to welcome Andresa and Liz. How are you ladies?

Liz: We’re doing great. Thanks for having us.

Andresa: Thank you so much.

Michelle: Thank you for honoring me with your presence and making time from your busy schedules. And so, I’ll just go ahead and jump right in, and let me start by asking you perhaps if you could both answer the following question, and that is, how did you grow up around the topic of money and finances and investing in general? Because, where I am today to how I grew up is completely different, and so I’m looking forward to hearing about that journey. Okay, Andresa, go ahead.

Andresa: Well, in Brazil, there was no such a thing in my time about like cash flow, real state, that conversation was not around the table. My dad back in the day, he had a job where he worked more than 9 to 5. He tried to start a business, and I was so young, I don’t remember, for some reason didn’t work out, went back to work. And my mom started working and build her haircut salon and expanded. But what I have found lately after, you know, my MBA in Brazil, I was like “Mom, something is off.” You know, you always say, “Oh, look my agenda is full. Look at this, I got to tell people that I don’t have more time.” I was like, “That’s bad actually, because you’re losing money.”

So we found out that she had a job, she didn’t have a business. She had a job, very successful, but it was a job. And as I moved here and I came across “Rich Dad Poor Dad” that book kind of literally open up a completely new world. And I was like, “Oh, okay so that’s how people do.” So they leverage your time, they build businesses, and they build systems, and they step out. So that’s how they’re able to do other things, more meaningful things.

And I kind of start doing that, telling my friends, they are my sisters. And it’s funny, my sister now, she is a physical therapist, and she expanded her business, she has a clinic. And she loves, loves renting the place. She has like rooms where they do makeup and they do different types of courses there where she’s not present, and she’s not active. So, that was a conversation that we had during years, and now she’s putting that in practice. She is like, “I love that.” Like…

Michelle: Dripping on my account while I’m not there. Yeah.

Andresa: Yeah. She’s like, “I’m here in the U.S. enjoying Christmas with you, and my business is running. I love that.” I was like, “Yeah, you didn’t love when I told you a couple of years ago.” So, that’s my story. So, the goal is that the next generation will see that as something that it’s common.

Michelle: Absolutely. How about you, Liz?

Liz: Yeah, it’s a great question. So, you know, I’m thinking about growing up, and I was raised in a, I think, second generational Italian family. And, you know, no one in our family had any experience with entrepreneurship at the time growing up. My parents were super hard working, you know, good middle class family, and I got a lot of value around the power of, it’s not so much how much you make, it’s how much you keep, and what you do with that money. So both my parents super frugal, they spent money where they wanted to spend money, but they didn’t have like, you know, my dad was a teacher, my mom worked insurance, I’m not gonna start crying because it makes me appreciative.

Michelle: Me too, so I know about the frugal, and…

Liz: Yeah. I mean, I feel like I got a lot of…

Michelle: Yeah, you got emotional in our show, I’m getting emotional on your show.

Liz: I feel like I’ve gotten a lot of like the importance of frugality, and the importance of like hustling, and the importance of work ethic from my parents. So, in terms of like the next level, I knew I had that in me. I knew I’m still pretty frugal and sometimes it gets in my way, but that’s a whole other story. But when I started going to grad school, my brother-in-law, at the time was my sister’s boyfriend and he started a business. I was like, “Wow, someone can start a business.” Like I knew that of it, but I never knew anyone close to me.

And I saw what he was doing, and he gave me “Rich Dad Poor Dad,” my brother-in-law. And at the time, my sister’s boyfriend who’s about become his fiancé, and he goes, “You got to read this book.” And I read it, and I was like, wow, there’s like, you can actually create assets. Like it’s this whole new world, you know, versus just working really hard. And at the same time, my parents did the same thing. They started to buy their first kind of rental property, and they bought a vacation home. And again, my parents both had very middle income jobs and they were able to figure that out.

My dad was pretty good with finances, so I’m like, “My parents did it and what can we do with our own?” So he ended up being our first lender and lended us 30,000 for our first duplex, our first property, to me and my husband. And at the time he was my boyfriend and he lended us money, I don’t know what he was thinking. And my dad is a pretty smart dude. But, hey, he did it, you know.

Michelle: He had faith in both of you there.

Liz: He did. And both of our sets of parents were both really, you know, good with their money, both sets. And so anyway that propelled us, but it got me really in tune with, wow, I can create something, you know. And I loved real estate, we started taking classes, I’m like, “This is powerful,” like this is an asset, we can see it, we can feel it versus other, you know, asset classes that we just couldn’t see or feel. So we got intrigued with that and we also got intrigued with like, this has power to like help people and create a business out of it. And we just started creating business plans and we were like dating like complete dorks me and my husband. And, you know, we were able to start something and grow it.

Michelle: Jack and I talk about those beginning times when we were just starting out investing in our journey in real estate. And we’re like, “Man, we were such, we call ourselves muffins, we were such muffins, man, back then.” So, do you ladies, so you both work with your spouses, correct? Andresa, do you?

Andresa: I no longer work with my ex-spouse. We went to a different direction. Although we do own properties together still, but we went to different directions which is another story, but we do own properties together, yeah.

Michelle: And Liz, so then you and Matt have always been working together?

Liz: Yeah. And we’ve had different roles. I mean, for many years when he decided to quit his job, I actually enjoyed my job. I enjoyed what I was doing. I mean, I liked real estate, but I knew of the entity and he really hated his job. So when we put job to job and role to role, he said, “Let me quit mine.” I said, “Go for it. I actually like what I do, but let’s keep growing this thing.” And then I ended up quitting my job and having a path of joining him full time around ’08, then the market crashed, which was really exciting times for us. But really made us who we are and just we got very creative on some of the assets we had bought. And then for a few years ended up going back to my work, and then I left it for good 2013. So I’ve always, I’ve had strategic roles, I’ve had kind of day to day roles, I’ve had various roles in our company over the years.

Michelle: You’re wearing all hats like that, but you have the phone, licking the letters, stamping the mail.

Liz: Got to do what you got to do.

Michelle: Absolutely. So let me ask you, Andresa, what is your company’s current focus right now and why do you invest in that specific asset class or what’s the biggest opportunity in whatever your focus is right now?

Andresa: So one thing that I started doing, when I started, I started doing more single families rehabs, and then you started scaling it. And then you say, “Oh, hold on a second, I can leverage my time much more and funds and skills if I do multiples at the same time.” So, as we partner up with other folks, the focus now is to buy land and do small developments or build multi-families and hold. That’s my focus right now.

And then, for more specific niche on the cash flow side, buying small single families in a very, very nice stable areas where we can rent long-term, or, if the law permits at that location, rent short-term, and then my role is to do the construction part. And, of course, we’re not buying anything turnkey, so we’re either building or improving and adding value to the property as we go. Same thing with, you know, I’m looking to be part of apartment complexes investments and then a construction management that’s also what I bring to the table.

Michelle: That’s awesome. When you said land, I’m like, “Woo, that’s music to my ears.” So, what opportunity are you seeing? Why go for the land and build versus buying already existing, for example, apartment complexes?

Liz: Sure. So, that’s like a myth that a lot of people think, “Oh, new construction is so much more complex and difficult.” And I am in Philadelphia, I cannot do TLC, I cannot just like, “Okay, let’s throw paint here, change the cabinets and we are good.” No, we’re in a very, very old city. So, if I am doing a rehab on a property, I need to do brand new electrical, plumbing, HVAC, it’s everything, right?

Michelle: So you might as well start with a clean slate, it could be easier.

Liz: It became easier. So, when somebody say, I have a shell, it’s just three walls. Great, I don’t need to do demo. I save money on that, right? And now, looking at, you know, with more experience for all the time in a couple of different new construction, it’s actually easier. Don’t get me wrong, when I say easier, that doesn’t mean that it’s less work. It’s a lot of planning before we start shoveling the dirt, right? It’s a lot of planning on that.

So if that’s executed well, next day, shovel starts and then we go, but there’s a lot of planning and less own for saying during the construction process. Because there’s no wall that I need to open and figure out, oh, there’s termite here, we need to replace this entire thing. So it’s easier on that sense, but requires a little bit more sophisticated planning prior of getting started.

Michelle: Yeah. For us too, like, we have never gone through the whole process of actually building all the way, but doing preliminary building plans for them, and improving, and then selling, and that has been able to add literally a zero to our land deals. Stuff that we purchased for $80,000, we’ve been able to sell for over $500,000 just because we had done that extra step of planning. That, yeah, it requires a little bit more time, because you’re getting building permits, and there’s a lag time there and so on and so forth. But it definitely is worth your time.

Andresa: Yeah 100%.

Michelle: And then you’re like thinking, okay, I’m not really thinking about volume, I can be much more selective and just work on a few deals that are gonna net me so much more than…but for us it’s always been also, from the point of view of wholesaling. And you’re taking it to the next level, which is basically building for long-term hold, which is amazing.

Andresa: Well, maybe we should combine. You guys do that part and then we’re ready just like, “Hey, throw the ball.”

Michelle: Yes. What about you, Liz, what is your company’s current focus right now? What are you guys investing in right now and why? What is the opportunity there for others if others wanted to jump in?

Liz: Yeah. Yeah, I mean, we’ve gotten involved in a lot of different things over the years, you know…

Michelle: You know, it’s like you evolve, you know, and…

Liz: Yeah, you evolve, I can make the list, a very long list, but we wouldn’t have enough time in the interview. So, when I look back, the area that, we’ve always had rentals, so, you know, buying hold strategy in essence has always been something we kind of have been focused on. And we started with single family homes, and then we got that first duplex, and then we grew it from there. So, currently, we invest, we have everything from small multi’s to large multi’s, and we’re involved in some apartment buildings. We’ve always invested locally and we’ve expanded that too, so we’re kind of on the, you know, kind of, just because the market becomes a little, what you say? You make the numbers work, you know…

Michelle: Yeah. Sometimes it just doesn’t make sense for us. Anything here in the Phoenix area, Tucson, Las Vegas, I mean, nothing makes sense on multi-family. So we have to, we are forced to go outside for sure.

Liz: Because we started in Jersey. We focused on Trenton, New Jersey, which is still an up and coming city in New Jersey that’s still figuring itself out. I mean, we have a portfolio there, but we’re not actively buying there as much anymore just because we’re good with what we have and we like to diversify other markets that are growing. So, yeah, that’s one major focus, and then obviously doing some other things. The other major focus, we’d like to have kind of like a capital gain for-sale projects going on as well because, you know, that has its own kind of positives to it.

And I think that’s always, some people have just a buy and hold. It’s like the active income, the passive income, and I know you speak a lot about that. So, we’ve done flips over the years, we’ve done a, you know, probably up to 20 flips, we have had various partners on them. And that, you know, some of them have been amazing and others not so much. So, what we learned through that is, as we’ve gotten more seasoned, not actually seasoned, but more experienced. We’ve learned we want to mitigate risk. And actually what I’m just saying, and that’s one of the things we partner up together from a real estate perspective is like, how do you mitigate the risk.

And, you know, I have to say, flips are risky I find, and we’ve had experienced more especially in this market. But the land deals and trying to develop some new construction could work, and now the market is interesting, right? You know, we don’t know what’s gonna happen, but if you do it the right way and you hedge your, you know, mitigate your risk, those still could be projects that could work even if the market dips a little bit. So, yeah, those are kind of like our focuses. You know, multi-family has always been one of our focuses since the beginning. We’re just also continually growing that and then…

Michelle: What size properties, like when you say multi-family like?

Liz: Yeah. So, we have building, like I said, everything from like duplex and small and multi’s to, our next was like a 50 unit, and then, you know, our latest purchase was a 200 unit.

Michelle: Yeah, yeah. That’s bigger or larger.

Liz: With a team, you know.

Michelle: Yeah, absolutely.

Liz: Obviously.

Michelle: Now, I’m very curious to find out. Well, I know that you guys are both in the northeast, but how did you guys meet? Was it through real estate? How do you decide that you wanna partner up and that you’re gonna start the real estate investor podcast and community, can whichever one wants to go, and tell me how did it all happen?

Liz: So, I found Andresa on BiggerPockets. And I think I’ve reached out to you initially. I’d say, I think I really learned a lot about you and stalked you a little bit, because like I saw her active, right? In a good way of course, in a nice way, in a non-creepy way. But, what I did, I learned like, I was really intrigued Andresa was doing a lot of flips and what have you in Philly. And, you know, so, again, it’s an area of our business that we had yet to really master and the construction side of it we’ve always relied on GCs and then they become, you know, what they become. It just wasn’t an area that was streamlined for us, so we were like, let’s maybe look at some other markets. We don’t know Philly, reached out to Andresa and we got together for coffee and just kind of like had a little bit of like a, you know, let’s learn about each other and start a friendship. So we were friends for at least what? Two or three years.

Andresa: Yeah, two years, I guess.

Liz: Two years. And then the other thing we did was we started a mastermind together. Andresa and I said, let’s get some women, and we started a women-only mastermind. Yeah, well before the investor stuff. So, what we did was like, we’d love to join forces with other women, wish we knew you too. But we just found some women and got together on a Zoom call or Skype call every month, you know, and what that does is just holding each other accountable. What are your goals? You know, so very grassroots. We didn’t go to any program, it was just something we started, and we’ve had that, probably what? Three years now? Four years, yeah. And that’s just, you know, we’re still on that. And then, so that’s how we met. That was your first question. I don’t want to…

Michelle: Yes. Andresa, what makes this partnership right now work? I know you got to know each other really well, you were friends before, you both have a love for real estate, but, what makes the partnership behind the scenes work?

Andresa: Well, as you guys can probably tell, Liz and I are very different. We have different approach, however, our values and where we want to be and the purpose of this investor community, it’s completely aligned. So, when you’re looking for partnerships, I would not never ever partner up with somebody that I don’t admire, that I don’t have their back. And I know that she has mine no matter what. So, that’s something…and I know for sure…

Michelle: This incredible level of respect for each other, absolutely.

Andresa: It’s beyond. I don’t remember what was it that I was talking to Matt. And then I said to him, “I don’t think Liz is gonna like this.” And he looked at me and he’s like, “It’s funny, you have her back, even with me.” I was like, “Yes, yeah, I do.” He’s like, “Yeah, I shouldn’t do this.” I was like, “Yeah.” Right? So I think that…that doesn’t mean that we don’t have disagreements, and the more that we evolved, we welcomed those perspectives and we welcomed the difference. And we need to, you know, right now we’re like so many things on our plate that we’re like, “Okay, how can we divide and conquer based on our abilities and personalities?” And that’s pure trust.

Michelle: Yeah. And basically trusting in each other’s genius and unique abilities to really come up with something game changing, which is, I think, what your collaboration has brought and what you’re growing. So I’ve been watching you, you know, since last year when I was first approached to be part of your podcast. And I joined the real estate investor community, and I’ve been watching you grow this platform and this brand, and then watching you I think at the beginning of this year or late last year roll out the initiative of, which I think is absolutely brilliant, of meetups across the country. And so, what is your short term, what is the long-term vision of this community? I love what you’re doing and I see the momentum that you’re having, and I think the members of the community are loving it. And what is your vision, what are you trying to build there?

Liz: Well, we could both probably contribute to that. But, you know, we really wanna conquer the world. Honestly, I mean, women outlive men by seven years. You know, women traditionally don’t have as much knowledge or confidence in the financial world, like we wanna change that. We really want the next generation of women, we want what we’re doing to impact the next generation of women where they own real estate, and they have financial security, and independence, independent of their husband or their partner. Like that’s a big mission I know, but that’s like what we’re trying to create. That’s what we’re up to, like that’s the big reason.

Michelle: I think this is why I love you guys so much, because that even makes like this hair on my back stand and on my arms. Because it’s like, yes, I can feel this at a cellular level, absolutely. So many times I have gotten approached actually as a result of the podcast that is originally intended for women, but there’s some beautiful enlightened men listening to it. And they’ve reached out, they want to invest, and then I don’t hear about the spouse, ever, I don’t hear about what her voice, what her opinions were, and so on and so forth. So, yeah, I’m sorry to interrupt, keep going.

Liz: Yeah, no. That’s like the big why, right? And I think we want to create a community that will always be free to women who can get support that they need, that doesn’t cost, I mean, there’s some amazing in you, you’ve been involved. There’s amazing things out there that cost quite a bit, and rightfully so. And that’s all great, and that’s all wonderful. We wanna create something that there’s a playing field for everyone and we are gonna always have like a free option, free community that’s always gonna be part of what we do. But we’ve gotten women to say, “Hey, we want more.” So we are looking at putting together, and, Andresa, if you wanna run with that idea, I don’t wanna talk too much.

Andresa: You’re doing great. I was like, that’s awesome, I wanna do that. So, yeah. So, a lot of the ladies are like, I love this community, this investor community on Facebook, which is free. And it’s good that they are, we have about 800 plus ladies there, that they are on your board. So, if there’s something that, “Oh, what do you guys think about this,” you have people with tremendous experience. They’re jumping in and say, “Hey, consider this, consider that,” in a matter that it’s a safe environment. And that’s something that we always focus on. The investor community came with idea that they really wanted to get together, right?

I did not speak that publicly, yeah, but we are having virtual meetup for the first time coming up soon which is so exciting. So we can get people from other countries to join. And the next step is what we call inner circle, are for the ladies that want to take to the next level, that want to really get to the point on their lives where they’re like, “Okay, I need to be challenged. I don’t need to be, nobody holding my hand, but I need that accountability, right? That mentorship around that.”

And Liz and I are brainstorming different options, because we don’t wanna reinvent the wheel, that’s not our idea. We don’t wanna reinvent, let me put together a course about this that could we? Yeah, but that’s not the thing. We want to look for ladies that already have, they master their field and collaborate with those ladies, so everybody is sitting down the table. Our main goal is to get women sitting down the table.

Liz: Yeah. Our vision is like almost like from a like a conference where women are really inspired by other women. Because there’s gonna be like a conference like obviously all women speakers and like, all the way to like accountability partner, like I’m gonna get up tomorrow, like, what the hell am I gonna do tomorrow around this goal of buying a property? And all that’s important, but I feel like people spend too much time on the rah-rah, which are awesome. And we’re gonna do and it’s important, but, when the rubber meets the road, Tuesday morning, I wake up, like who’s holding me accountable? Who is holding me accountable to my goals? And we all need it, right? It doesn’t matter where you are in your life. I need it, shit. I’m like, I asked the ladies on my mastermind, like, I need accountability. I’m gonna do this by next meeting. Because if I don’t tell you, I’m not gonna do it.

Michelle: Absolutely, yeah. We have a similar group. It’s not ladies specifically for our land profit generator, it’s a free Facebook group. And, yes, can you count on an incredibly powerful brain trust and generosity with time and knowledge from everyone there. But the moment that you really want to step up, like you said, and you want that extra level of accountability of collapsing of time, of making sure that, okay, you decide on a big goal and I always say that, the biggest fuel for a goal or for a desire is really speed. And sometimes our mind, fear creeps in, and fear hates speed, and it wants you to keep on thinking, and analyzing, and debating whether you should go for this or not.

And accountability completely changes that, because then you wake up on Tuesday, like you said this, and you’re like, “Okay, you know, I told this person that by Friday I would have this amount of shit done. And so it needs to be done. And so what am I gonna do today to make it happen?” So, totally on board there with you. Now, going back to the ladies community that you guys have, why do you think women in general are so hesitant sometimes to speak up, to be visible and to lead and hence the need for a women-only community? Because I noticed that.

Andresa: Yeah. So, I’m gonna share experience that I had. We were in a big conference, and we had different investors around, and we start texting each other how freaking boring that was. We don’t understand why that guy was on stage, clearly knowledgeable, clearly now opted to share his knowledge, right? Different thing.

Michelle: You can sense that yeah.

Andresa: His energy so low. I’m just like, “Oh my gosh, dude, jump, jump, jump, jump, get your energy up, like, give me something here.” And I was like, started getting like, not upset, but it was like questioning, why aren’t those ladies next to me on stage? They should be there. And I have this conversation with another woman on the table, and I said, “Why aren’t you there?” She’s like, “That’s not how I gain business.” I was like, “But maybe that’s a perception of how to gain business.” I was like, I don’t think women see other women on stage and stepping up and making decisions. Therefore, it doesn’t even cross their mind that that will impact the other generations. So I want the young generations to see me as a woman, for example, at the construction site. I am not the designer, I am not the architect, okay? I am not.

Michelle: That I am making things pretty.

Andresa: Yeah. Right? I am the one approving your checks. That’s who I am. I am the one in on stage, that’s who I am. Because I think that is still unconscious that we don’t even know if we are worth it to sit down at the table and make decisions, because who are we surrounded with? I don’t see other women sitting down at the table, so, the fear and then the confidence creeps in. So, that’s one of my reasons.

Liz: Yeah. I think the other thing too is like, you know, it’s interesting, because people have asked us that and continue to ask us that, why women only? And, you know, Andresa and I both have had very healthy relationships with men. You know, in general, we work with men. It’s not like we don’t like men, it’s not about that, right?

Michelle: Yeah. It’s not about being manly or not. People at the beginning question, even within the group, why are you only creating this podcast only for women? I’m like, “Because you have plenty of role models that are guys that are men, and I’d love to step up and have women see other women, you know, leading.”

Liz: And I’ll give you an example too that I’m starting to see, is that women are more comfortable with other women. I should say most women are more comfortable asking questions, especially if they’re not confident in an area, with other women. We had a meetup a couple weeks ago. If women are comfortable with women, they go deep and they go quickly, you know, into that. If they’re not, they don’t. But, you could see the energy of the room, there’s 20 women, the last woman asked the question, “Can I ask a question?” I was presenting on team building, but we got into a bunch of different topics. “So can I ask a question.” I’m like, “Sure.” She’s like, “I’m getting married in two months, and my husband, my soon-to-be husband and I are talking and thinking about buying real estate together.”

And she’s like, “I’m really nervous, and here’s why I’m nervous. And I’d love to hear from the married women who have done this with their husbands and what did you do to protect yourself or how did you approach it?” And then like three women and, you know, I jumped in, two other women. One woman is like, you know, we went all in, we’re very faith based, so, nothing else was an option for us. Another woman said, we had really good contract, like everyone had different, like, I was like, this is awesome. This conversation is awesome. Because she’s getting the support she needs in a very real authentic way, and literally, we’d been there for two hours and no one knew each other before two hours ago. I was like, “This is so cool.”

Michelle: Yeah, the level of intimacy.

Liz: Yeah. Most networking groups, you go to…when it’s a com…you don’t go there. Everyone’s like, “What do you do? How many apartment buildings you own or how many rental own?” What’s your ego claim to fame?

Michelle: Superficial talk, yeah, protecting facades, yeah, absolutely.

Liz: Or people talk about how much money they make. I don’t know what women, women don’t do that normally, but men do. They love to talk about how much money they make. But, anyway.

Michelle: Pride comes from their wanting to be providers and make sure that other people can see that they’re being great providers.

Liz: That’s right. That’s a good thing. Yeah, yeah.

Michelle: That’s the only thing I can think of. Now, I had a question, and I remember when you both ladies interviewed me, and I don’t know if it has to do, right now, with what we’re talking. I think it may be closely related. And something that you guys asked me and I talked about identity and about deciding on your identity. I know that it both really resonated with both, and now, after working longer with women across all the U.S. and your community, why do you think that is important? I think Andresa may have already touched a little bit upon it.

Andresa: Yeah. It brought so many memories to me, that question. Because, I mentioned like, in a nutshell, you were saying, you need to figure out if you’re a type of girl, it’s $1, $10, $100, $1,000, $10,000, what’s your money identity? And I was like, “Whoa, whoa, yes, yes. Because, mentally, you are gonna have that, you know, ceiling that you’re gonna put, and that’s it. But if you’re not even aware that that’s where you’re doing around it.

Like with everything, right? Not just real estate, like let’s say, oh yeah, I’m doing like one house at a time, I can’t imagine doing two. Or, I can’t imagine doing, what? Right? So, I think that it goes across, and when you said that, I went into listening mode, I stopped interviewing you because you got into me, I was like, “Whoa, what is my identity?” And since then I changed a lot since that interview, in a good way. In a good way. Because it was not on my aware spot in my head.

Michelle: Yes, blind spots, we all have them, absolutely.

Andresa: Yes. So, for the time…and then I started making more conscious decisions about where do I spend, where do I invest long-term, short-term, really why? And it’s all around my identity and what I believe I deserve or I’m worth it. Yes, I’m worth it this? No, I’m not worth it that, no thank you. Start saying more nos than yeses, right? So, it was super important just to bring that from the back end to the front stage.

Liz: Yeah. It resonated with me a lot too in so many ways. And I think, full circle, what’s really neat is, we’re reading a book on our mastermind right now called “Atomic Habits.” And I’ve read other books on habits and they’re great, but I’m like, “Oh, another book on habi…”

Michelle: I’m gonna take notes.

Liz: Yeah. And I’m like, “Oh, another book on habits yep, yep, yep.” But I’m like, “Okay, I’ll go along with the group, I’ll get the book.” I mean, it is an awesome, awesome book. It is like, I’m in Chapter three, and I’m like, this is awesome stuff. But what is reminding me of is exactly what you’re saying, right? We talk about the goals that we have, but he’s like, don’t set goals anymore. Just create really powerful habits, and systems, and processes in your life that are gonna move you towards that goal.

Michelle: The goals is gonna happen.

Liz: The goal is gonna happen. It’s gonna happen by default if you’re doing X, Y, and Z. I’m like, I knew that, but to like the way he said it, I was like, “Yeah, I’m focused too much on,” and then, you know, you look at your own stuff, and where you’re getting roadblocks. So, I think, but it all comes back to the whole being, right? The whole identity, the whole who am I. And, you know, if I want X, is it really reverse engineering to the way I think of myself? And, you know, I think we all have things to work on with that, I know I do. All the time. I feel like I’m always looking in the mirror like, you know, but it is. It’s, you know, worth, and good enough, and what brings me joy, you know, and I think that’s all really, you really got it to a level where it was like, not good to know. But like people need to know this stuff, like people need to know what their identity is. It’s not like, that’s gonna get in their way of really getting what they want, and really achieving what they want.

Michelle: Yeah. What do you attribute your success so far, and what do you think is going to give you that next level of expansion?

Andresa: I heard this term today, I’m gonna use it. It’s called the white-belt mentality. So the white-belt mentality.

Liz: I love that, because I can’t use it again.

Andresa: It’s about, even though if you’re a black-belt, you have to have the mentality of a white belt, always learning, always revolving. And, in my identity, if you look at me a couple of years ago, I’m not the same person, my goals changed, you know, my core values is still the same but the things that I said, yeah as at the past, I probably say no now, are more selective, more aware, more focused on putting myself first, what I thought was selfish before now is selfless to me, taking care of my mental health, my physical health, so I can perform and be a spectacular mom, a great friend, a daughter, a friend to the friends that I have. So, that to me is my first thing. Being a white-belt, having a white-belt mentality.

Michelle: Liz?

Liz: The things that we’ve made we feel like helped us be successful?

Michelle: Yeah.

Liz: I mean, I wrote down two because I like to write things down because I forget them if I don’t. But, I feel like faith. I mean, there’s…faith has been really important to me my whole life, but I feel like you realize your faith or you exercise your faith when things aren’t going well, or when something isn’t working, and you become more connected, if you will, to the universe, call it what you will, universe, God, whatever. But, I don’t know if I’d be where I am without that, right? So, that’s just, you know, my relationship with say, God, what have you.

Michelle: It’s an anchor, you know, it gives your soul certainty to move forward. Yeah.

Liz: I like that. Soul certainty to move forward, I like that. You really got those nuggets, Michelle, you know. And the second thing is, never give up. I mean, I can like literally go on for an hour of all the things that have occurred in our business over the years. And there’s just been so many times that just, this isn’t working, let’s just throw in the towel. And I knew that we were on to really good things and we stuck it through, we made it work, we just never give up. That’s not in my DNA, it’s not in my husband’s DNA, it’s not in Andresa’s DNA. And I think that’s another key thing about a partner. I mean, I will persevere until it works, and whatever it takes. So, I know, if something comes up, I know with that way of being and with faith, we can kind of deal with whatever.

Michelle: Yeah, yeah. We call it, in our world, you get in line and you stay in line.

Liz: I like that.

Michelle: So, how do you both, you’re both incredibly successful real estate investors, women, and how do you bring inflows, and so that is bringing inflows of cash, so I know how you bring inflows of cash in your life. So how do you bring inflows of ease, of grace, of lightness to your everyday? How do you both do that?

Andresa: That’s a good question. To me, I will name two things, meditation for sure in a daily basis, and a gratitude journal, where I really focus on what I am feeling grateful for, not what I should be grateful for. Different, right? So, it brought me a lot of awareness, and I am the type of person that goes a mile like 100 miles per hour, so I need to calm down my mind, otherwise I’ll be like laying down and think, oh my gosh, this deal, that deal, this deal, what is gonna happen?

Michelle: Purple squirrels, green squirrels everywhere your mind.

Andresa: Right. And I was like, should I text everybody now about this idea? Or should I hold? It was like, and I talked to my brain, I was like, “Dude, calm down. Like, let’s sleep right now.”

Michelle: You talk to your itty bitty shitty committee and you’re like, “Okay, relax, it can get a little run.”

Andresa: You know, I always try different types of meditations. And I was like, “I’m not cut for it.” But I made a choice. My identity, the person that I want to be in life, the life that I want to have, that person does meditation every day, that person eats healthy every day, that person does gratitude journal every day. That person is not perfect, okay? Makes mistakes, have setbacks and everything. But that’s what that person does, so that’s what I’m going to do.

Michelle: Yeah, beautiful. Thank you.

Liz: I think ease and grace have been two things that I’ve struggled with quite honestly. But…I’ll say and instead of but, right? It’s better, that’s another approach. And I have worked on being present with people, so I really work at, wherever I am, really just being there. And that does help my grace and ease I think. I think that does contribute to that, I can always get better. And then having kids, quite honestly, I would work literally 24 hours a day. I used to travel a lot when I did have my day job. I traveled I was a consultant, so someone who likes to please and help people, and now you’re like at beck and call, right? You think about it as a consultant. I was just working overtime and overtime and traveling and what have you and I didn’t have any ease and grace in my life. Of course, I wanted to spend time with my husband, but I’m like, “Oh, that could wait,” you know, that could wait.

But thank God I, you know, when having my first, I have, you know, two little ones, they have helped me become so like create more ease and grace. I mean, it’s chaotic because they’re five and two and they’re just, you know, both naughty most of the time. But, I will say, like, there’s grace there, there is an ease in some ways for me, because I’m talking about something with my son and he’s asking me questions about the water is blue…

Michelle: And you’re present, and you’re…

Liz: Yeah. And I’m like, you know, it’s a good question, let’s look it up on Google. And I’m like, that’s contributing in some ways to my peace in a really weird way. It is. So I think that’s allowed me to become a little more, have this sense of ease. It’s something I still work at, you know, I think that’s an area that I don’t know if I have mastered by now.

Michelle: Even me, I have struggled with it. And my struggle has come from the point of view of, I’m like, “Oh my gosh, I think I can do this, and I don’t think anyone will do this better than I can do.” And so I’ve been very hesitant and reluctant to ask for help. And now, that is one of the biggest ahas that I’ve had has been in basically seeking support, more support than I think I need so that I can have some ease and grace in my life too.

Liz: Well, when you talk about what’s next, I think that’s next. Because, building of the team, getting support for all the different things we’re involved in, you know, both on, you know, the real estate side and the investor side, like, that’s definitely tough of mine right now. You know, because I know that’s gonna help.

Michelle: Yeah. To wrap things up, I would love to ask you, so, what’s next? How can people get a hold of you if people wanted to learn more about you, about the real estate investor community, what’s out there?

Liz: Me? Yeah, so. We would love to, I mean, you know, we love supporting men, but obviously our mission is to support women. So, they can, you know, we have a weekly podcast, you know, you can go to therealestateinvesther.com and, you know, you can check out I think Michelle’s in the 20s from my memory. But we’ve got 63 episodes out there right now.

Michelle: Yeah. You guys are my heroes. You guys are the ones that I look up to now in the podcast world.

Liz: Ow, stop. And check us out on Facebook, just go to Facebook and you can actually get it from our website as well. We have a Facebook group that’s growing. We also have a…

Michelle: And it’s incredibly active, and there, again, the ladies incredibly generous with their time and with their knowledge. Absolutely, I can see it.

Liz: We just recently, like you mentioned, Michelle, started, you know, pretty much starting meetups, investher meetups across the country with the intent of bringing more women out to the community, and to really get them the education and the support they need. So, right now, we’re up to almost, we have three more new ones coming on. So I think we’re up to eight or nine. Yeah, one is in Canada too. So, I mean, it’s just a normal kind of, if you think about meetups, but with a more, you know, feminine support network that is actually creating more accountability for women rather than just passing along business cards.

So, we’re always looking for new and committed women to kinda help lead these, we know we can’t do it all, we’re not interested in doing it all. So, that would be a great ask if any ladies’ listening, really want to be part of this community and as a potential leader, you know, reach out to us and I can give you my email. It’s liz@therealestateinvesther.com.

Michelle: Beautiful. Thank you so much, ladies. It has been such a pleasure. I cannot think of a better way to have spent my last 50 something minutes then talking about this with kindred souls and spirits. Thank you very much, Andresa. Thank you so much, Liz. And any final words, anything else?

Liz: Thank you for having us on, you know. And I think what you’re up to with this podcast is amazing, because it’s not about just, you know, achieving, it’s about doing it in a, with ease and grace. And I think you’re a leader in that, Michelle, and I think you’re someone more people should be listening to and you’re amazing, so…

Michelle: Maybe because I struggled with it too.

Liz: It’s a great topic. I think it’s something that we need to be broaching in our investor community, because that’s the whole idea of balance, right? Becoming financially free and balanced, and doing it with grace, right? So, thank you for all you’re doing, and thanks for.

Andresa: Exactly. I remember when Liz and I were getting, interviewing you, and then we hang up, we were like, “Did you feel her energy?” No, it’s just something else. And, yes, you are, you’re something else, you’re a gift to this world. And I think it’s our privilege to be around you.

Michelle: Same here. I mean, the same, the same. I am all in for whatever you ladies are doing, anything that you need support with. Yeah, I’d love to help you continue. It’s about collaboration and helping each other, so, thank you to both.

Andresa: Thank you so much.

Liz: Take care.

Michelle: Take care.